Fascast Training, they have implemented the training optimization through HRV readings automatically. That is something they have done recently. This feature would help and give a more dynamic boost to the workout selection process, and everything would adjust automatically, making Xert much more accurate.
HRV readings are problematic and unreliable. They really donât do much better than simply asking yourself the question âHow do I feel today?â or just taking your resting heart rate consistently every morning. Rather than automate the use of HRV data in Xert through direct integration with various 3rd party systems (Whoop, Garmin, HRV4Training, etc. etc.), weâll likely find alternative ways to incorporate feedback that you can adjust using data from these other systems (input a readiness score into XATA) or simply answering that question and having the system adjust accordingly. Far simpler and more effective in the end.
But itâs a very good suggestion. We have been thinking about HRV for some time and how best to use this within Xert. We have some other big things coming that we hope will improve things and hopefully make our algorithm that detects tiredness using your training history even better. One of the main differentiators of doing it this way is that we can better predict and plan for your tiredness from training in the future. HRV-based systems can only help you with what you can do today and donât offer any help on what you should do tomorrow or the day after.
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xert can be abit of a difficult system to use sometimes( dont really know what im doing), is there a way that it can be made more user friendly
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It can be incorporated and let the user the option to enable or disable!
Have you watched the 9 Xert Academy videos? Endurance training isnât a simple topic and some new ideas have to be learned. But once you learn them, youâll be much more knowledgeable about yourself and what it takes to improve.
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i have however i have hit a plateau and cant seem to shake it off
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Start a new post on plateaus. We can discuss.
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ill be using XERT for about 6+ years. Like all new concepts, it is a bit confusing at the beginning but if you start reading the blogs and following different questions on the forum you will be learning a lot.
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Interested to know if anyoneâs used the new fascat app? I bought a few of their off the peg plans years ago and they were great, I checked the other day and you can no longer just buy a plan and have to sign up for a subscription with the app etc which I donât need/want.
Itâs a shame as I sometimes like the rigidity of a fixed plan.
I listen to Frank on his podcast where he states you canât take one âpoorâ HRV reading in isolation, there has to be a trend over days or whatever time period so wondering how this works with training recommendations.
I did the whoop thing a couple of years ago for 6 months and have it on my fenix now and find it an inaccurate guage of training suitability from basic yes/no to intensity/duration.
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ok thank you
I think something HRV in all itâs variations offers what a power data based algorithm will never be able to predict is the lots of other factors that make a person more or less ready to train from day to day: Sleep quality, temperature, life stress, illness, food, hydration, alcoholâŚ
Those might one day be more or less successfully interpreted by a wearable measuring HR, HRV, body temp, sleep, whatever else. But none of it has anything to do with the training the person did recently or in a longer time frame. Might be that failure to achieve the predicted power values and the way you fail could indicated after the fact that you were not ready to perform but then the damage is probably done.
And a more or less correct guess by a wearable with lots of data might for many be preferable to answering the question manually every time you think about training. Some people overestimate their readiness to train (competitive athlete types?) or simply have no idea by feel alone (none athletes) and transferring a value from one system to the other manually and probably adjusting a scale while doing it might not be something people like to do in this time and age of interconnected systems. And I do see the problem of connecting to all the different systems with different âscalesâ by a small team of developers as well of course.
I have a Garmin Epix and an Oura ring and both deliver more or less useful data day to day. But they are sometimes completely wrong as well. Think I slept well, when I hardly slept at all and stuff like that.
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Thanks. Another aspect to using HRV (or even just feelings) is that they are one-dimensional. For example, say youâre tired from a long swim and readiness is poor. Your readiness for cycling might be ok at the same time, perhaps for an endurance ride. Your heart rate integrates many bodily responses and some pertain to ability to train and others may not. Lack of readiness may be true for one type of exercise but doesnât pertain to another. Parsing this information is not something the current technology is able to do.
Xert does this partially already with your power data by separating strain into 3 different systems. It is possible to be very tired from a hard high intensity effort (perhaps making HRV suggest youâre not ready for more training) but your low intensity system is still ready for action. I know the feeling myself - Iâll feel tired but somehow my legs just want to keep pushing power near my LTP without any feeling of additional fatigue.
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I had Covid at Christmas last year, felt absolutely awful, HRV4Training had me normal until four days in and then it picked up I wasnât so fresh. Next day it had me back at normal, despite still testing positive and feeling poor. Not used it since. Ultimately, how you feel is how you feel.
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I like that, I am finding that my Garmin Readiness score correlates much closer to my actual perceived feeling then the color of my stars do. Would love to incorporate that score somehow
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I would like to see some endurance/recovery workouts using DFA a1 where the trainer automatically adjusts the power/wattage to hit a specific number, like .75-1.00, It could take rolling 20 second readings so the power isnât jumpy. This could be a game changer for recovery and endurance rides. Recovery would force you above 1.0
While DFAa1 appears to have some promise of identifying LT1, many get invalid results. Also there is no evidence yet that training precisely below LT1 rather and a more rough estimate of LT1 provides non-marginal benefits. Hence, for us it doesnât appear to be worth the trouble (yet) to implement. Our new 2.0 model will do a better job at identifying LT1 without the need for HR. It will also do far more than that. 
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Thanks Armando, appreciate the response.
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Have a word with Marco Altini. I think he might beg to differ
Any idea on a timeline for this?
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Marcoâs stuff is very good so long as you donât feed it wonky data. You need a good consistent measurement routine. @tfk Does a great job summarizing the space here: everything you need to know: Garmin, Whoop, and Oura HRV measurements
(I actually wanted to see what ChatGPT has to say about HRV, but itâs down atm.)
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