Workout on Tacx neo: resistance

When I ride a workout on my Tacx neo (I use the app from Xert) I have the impression (conviction) that the resistance is much higher than when I ride the same workout outdoor. Solutions?

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Hi @lucvh,

Do you have a power meter that you use for your outdoor rides? And are you using the Power directly from the Neo for your workouts?

Both answers: yes. Do I have to change? More info: indoor I use an old bike (not the same as outside)

Your conviction is spot-on. I too have a Neo1 and although the power is identical to my Faveros, it’s definitely more difficult to generate the power on the Neo.

This is a well documented occurance, some people ‘feel it’ more than others. My understanding (and experience) tells me that over time with very consistent indoor training the difference does decrease, in that the perceived effort indoors improves to match outdoors.

It’s frustrating though when you’re prescribed 4-5 star workouts that are impossible indoors.
I’m considering increasing the % watts from my iphone when doing an indoor workout to more-closely match the Difficulty level prescribed. This has implications in other areas but which I need to think about.

I would love to discuss this more with others who have similar experience and hear what their solution is.

I have the same feeling (more a conviction). I ride the workouts on Neo in ‘slope mode’. The frustration is still there: impossible to keep the wattage indoor for workouts with, for me, more than 2 stars difficulty.

Good idea to use Slope mode, that should definitely decrease the PE.
I prefer ERG/Auto mode personally.

You could also use a larger gear which will help.

I was going to post a topic similar to this, but I’ll add on. I recently got a new bike with a Rotor Inpower (left side power meter). I also had some Powertap P1S pedals on my old bike that I swapped over for a little non scientific experiment.

I had my Elite Suito, Powertap P1S, and Rotor InPower all calibrated and set to record on different devices. The first test was just doing a Tour de Zwift stage and comparing the data. The P1 and Rotor trended together, but read 10-20 percent lower depending on the Critical Power.

The second was a Xert workout controlled by my iPhone connected to the Suito and the Rotor connected on the Wahoo Bolt. However this time I slowed my cadence and made an concerted effort to pedal against a constant resistance. The data sets came within 5-7% of each other. The Powertap data was close, but I think the batteries started dying or my Fenix watch had issues because it was constantly dropping.

Now I have more questions and observations. It looks like the Rotor is slower to catch the 1-5 sec efforts. Could the ERG mode be causing the pedals and crank powermeters to read low at higher cadences? I also tried using the rotor as the source to control the trainer, but the workout RPE seemed higher. I made some mental notes to compare the RPE of power outputs on my next outdoor ride.

Should I continue to bypass the Suito as the power source and use my Rotor? Feedback please @ManofSteele

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I’ve been down this rabbit hole before with 2 power meters and a Neo. It’s not a lot of fun to be honest and like you I had more questions than answers. I’m fortunate that the differences in my data was much smaller than what you’re experiencing however.

My advice is to use whatever is most convenient indoors, and adjust for the difference with the Xert iPhone app.
I’ve heard good things about the accuracy of the Suito.

I “raced” another stage per say and the numbers tracked closer, as I was pushing with consistent pedal pressure. I’m right handed, so I could be more right leg dominant as another possible explanation. A imbalance of 46-48% with my left leg would make a huge difference. IDK I’ll probably continue to track and tinker with adjusting it in the app a little longer until I get exhausted with it. Not sure why I’m concerned, just curiosity I reckon. The Suito has pretty good ratings from Zwift insider, so I feel confident in it. Thanks for your input

Based on the data provided, is there any reason why you can’t use the P1’s for power source always (other than the pain of swapping pedals back and forth)? If consistency is your main focus, that’d be the way to go.

If not, then feel free to use the Rotor for all rides on the other bike, the values are close enough, with the exception of short duration, supramaximal sprints (where of course a pedal PM is going to record higher than a spider-based/crank-based PM).

Interesting that you found the workout RPE higher when using a power source that reads consistently below your trainer…

I’m going to stick with the Rotor on my new bike, primarily because I have buddy who wants to getting into cycling and will use the P1s on my old bike. I think I’ll need to reevaluate fitness signature to knock my threshold power down some. I did do another workout/ test.

SMART - Won’t get fooled (3x12s at 80% TP - 183W for me)
Set 1 (Suito controlling): Suito Data (183 W), Rotor (167W) HR:144bpm
Set 2 (Rotor controlling): Suito Data (209 W), Rotor (183W) HR:156 bpm
Set 3 The same as set 2 with the P1s controlling

First set just felt aerobic and legs felt great
Second and third felt harder, but doable. It seemed more like a sweetspot workout with some burn in the legs. Per Training Peaks and Garmin my LTHR is 169, so the latter sets were closer to that.

I think the Suito has inflated my TP some and I don’t mind taking a hit to the TP as long as the training is consistent. Whats the best way to reset my signature with data from the Rotor for future training? Thanks for the help again!

If you go to activity details for this activity and click on the ‘Advanced MPA’ option in the middle on the right-hand side, you can directly edit the fitness signature. Know your TP down whatever feels appropriate ( a few Watts or 5%, for example) and then click the ‘save’ button to save the new signature and use that signature moving forward. Hope that makes sense!

Not sure that this will help but I thought I might share.

I’m using an old bike on my trainer. I was a bit frustrated that there was such a big discrepancy between my Neo 2 and my P1’s. After giving some love to my drive train it went down. Then I decided to swap chain, cassette, and chain rings, and make sure that everything was well adjusted. I could never spot any (signifcant) difference between the P1’s and the NEO after the service.

Even though the drive train was a old and dirty I could never have imagined that it would have such a big impact. Haven’t had the P1’s on the trainer bike for a year or so now. It’s still easier to generate power outside though, but that has been my experience for 15 years now, so I don’t think that will change regardless of indoor equipment.