ERG mode does not work on the Xert Workout Player on a Garmin Edge 530

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Hey everyone! I have a Garmin Edge 530 and a Cyclotronics indoor trainer (BLE & ANT+), and I can’t use the ERG mode on the remote player - the resistance simply gets close to zero and don’t respond to the intervals.

Using the Slope and Resistance modes works fine. Also, using the vanilla training app from Garmin works okay with a target power. Only the Xert ERG is not working.

Interestingly, I have a similar issue when using the Android App. Xert does not detect the trainer control, although Zwift does (and works fine).

Any ideas?

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Hi Danilo,

Sorry you’re having troubles with the trainer. I’m not exactly familiar with that trainer, but our app(s) support the industry standard ANT FE-C and Bluetooth FTMS protocols for Trainer Control - if the trainer doesn’t support those specific protocols, then trainer control (ERG) won’t function with our apps.

You may want to check with the manufacturer and check for the specific ANT/BT protocols, or check if your trainer is running the latest firmware.

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Hi Danilo,
I bought a Cyclotronics. It is a local (Brazilian) brand, @ManofSteele.
For me, it is replacing a Wahoo Kickr Core unit that got an electronic problem.

My unit arrived last week and I notice the same connection problem when using BLE and ERG with The Sufferfest (ANT+ connection was working properly).
Immediately the support from Cyclotronics let me know that a firmware update would solve it and the next day they provided it. Check the chart below.

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Hope it will help in the case you didn’t solve yet.

Now, I came to your post Googling for pieces of information about the Cyclotronics in Cycling Forums.

@danlessa, What has been your experience with Cyclotronics?

Since I used to have my power curve with Wahoo Kickrs confirmed against Favero Assioma Duo powermeter pedals, I initially found Cyclotronics inaccurate.

I am working on it with their support, but I would like to know the experience of our community of users.

Best,
Alvaro

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Ask Cyclotronics support if the firmware update supports Bluetooth FTMS specifically. I don’t see that listed on the chart.

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Thanks @alvarojsn . I’m going to contact the support for getting that update.

About precision: Not trivial. My experience tells that Cyclotronics tends to fare better under steady intervals, and have increasing errors during micro intervals. Also, the error seems to increase with time (see last figure), with tha trainer biasing towards under-estimating the actual power.

Another thing is that Cyclotronics tends to underestimate power during HI efforts, and over-estimate during low efforts.

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Hi Danilo,
It is great to find someone that compared power measurements including Cyclotronics.
Let me know if you want to share more of your experience.

I used to have an amazing experience with Wahoo Kickr Core. The power of Assioma Duo and Kickr Core used to match very well in all ranges of power and over time, many times under 1% if a zeroing and spindown were performed, respectively, at the beginning of the test.
Unfortunately, I got an electronic problem with Wahoo and there is no support/service in Brazil. Until I have the opportunity to ship Wahoo Kickr back to be serviced in the US, I bought this Cyclotronics.
The most important factor I decided to buy Cyclotronics was due to the local support. I got very frustrated that Wahoo refused to ship me the electronic board, even though I would assume the risks and pay for it. Shipping the whole trainer to the US has a prohibitive cost right now.

With Cyclotronics, although they claim to have inbuilt a real torque measurement, I am seeing huge differences, depending on the test. For example, sprinting at 1000+W using level mode showed between 25 and 30% delta (see image below).

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In the power range from 100 to 330W and using ERG, I see the errors starting underestimating resistance (pedals showing a lower power than trainer) and at the superior side of the range, I see the opposite. During a workout on Tuesday, an interval @328W (using ERG) showed that 228W figure as the average for the trainer, while the Assioma was showing an average between 340-342W (see image below).

(new user / got limited to post a second image - see next post: Fig. 2)

Here you see a comparison of Wahoo vs Assioma. In this particular comparison, I did not perform spindown or zeroed the pedals.

(see next post: Fig. 3)

Here another comparison, this one after doing spindown and zero.

(see next post: Fig. 4)

The interval at 15 min showing the highest difference had an average of 286 vs 291 W (Wahoo vs pedals).

The overall workout averaged 207 vs 205 W, respectively, with “normalized” (xPower) 233 vs 232W.
This is the kind of matching I was expecting with the new smart trainer. Hopefully I will get support to fix that.

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Fig. 2

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Fig. 3 and 4 (new user - not allowed 2 images neither 3 posts in sequence, had to combine Figures 3 and 4 in one image).

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[Fig. 4 would appear here]

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@alvarojsn

Your experience seems to match mine. Cyclotronics tends to underestimate the power on high intensity efforts and over-estimate under low intensity. Another interesting effect is the fact that Cyclotronics tends to have a “drift” after high intensity intervals, on which it tends to under-estimate recovery intervals for about 1-4min. This is visible on your comparisons and mine’s too.

One thing to observe is that Cyclotronics measurements tends to have higher errors with time. Maybe there’s a thermal drift? Power measuring units are well known for having errors due to not accounting for temperature changes correctly.

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By the way @alvarojsn, do you have a link for the firmware update? I’ve asked Cyclotronics support for it, but I’m not sure how long it is going to take to them to answer

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I know that Wahoo Kickr Core has a temperature sensor, which reports the unit temperature when performing the spindown. They also request a 10-15 min warmup before doing the spindown.
After that, I used to be very happy with the match with Favero Assioma Duo.
I have no reason to untrust the pedals’ power meter, I have consistent data over time, no problems at all, and reviewers also give excellent testimonials on Assioma.

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You can reach me by WhatsApp 55 16 98111 6443 (I hope it is allowed to provide this kind of contact here).

But I am not sure if it would be recommended to do this kind of firmware update using the file prepared to another unit. If I understood correctly, when I updated my unit they also provided changes in the calibration in order to improve the accuracy erros I was seeing in my first test.

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Just for the update: I’ve contacted Cyclotronics support with @alvarojsn help, and they provided me some newer firmware that makes uses of Bluetooth FTMS. Neither of them fix the Android app, although the Garmin IQ app started working.

Mostly probably the fault is on Cyclotronics’ end, as Zwift Android is not working either - it does detects the trainer, but the power never goes above 0W

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Another update: after firmware version 1.12, everything is working fine! Power measurement and control is confirmed to be working on:

macOS via BLE
Android via BLE
Garmin Edge 530 via ANT+

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